Justice, the little people and the industrial war machine
3 responses | 1 like
Started by wglassfo - Feb. 14, 2020, 1:27 a.m.

Barr and Trump tweets are currently headline news

Well: that is an issue that is miles over my head

But: I can relate a real life issue that actually happened to the little people [my family and the American justice system] We have had two instances but I will only comment on one as the other is in the process of litigation

My son was busted in some american state doing approx 200 MPH in a 60 MPH zone. He had a really nice Dodge charger that would really zoom.

He got busted, as the local speed officiers finally figured out how to beat his fuzz buster.The arresting officer was so hostile he hauled my son before the JP and my son spent a nite in county jail

His girl friend is a lawyer, but had  no legal jurisdiction in that state

The next morning my son goes before a county/local judege as a potential criminal to face the whims of local justice. His lawyer/girlfriend is in the spectator section as any loyal girll friend would do. If he is charged and has to spend time in a local jail, she wants to at least know.

Well: The stars must have been in favour of my son. The judge looks at the charge, questions the motive as to why a nite in county jail is deemed proper and other questions to the arresting officer. My son says nothing in his defense. It seems he did not get a chance as the judge took over the proceedings

Result: The judge ruled time spent in jail was sufficient and my sone was released

Now he did not have a local lawyer with him as any lawyer his girl friend could contact refused to touch the case

I talked to a retired defense lawyer from Florida and he said that corrupt judges make it hard for defense lawyers to be paid, other than the low rate that is paid by the country and most are discouraged from acting as defense lawyers unless they can attract high profile cases with some hope of payment

This makes me think many of the prison population is from low income people simply because they will plead to a lessor charge with no trial by jury simply because they can not afford or find a lawyer. My son was lucky and had resources if he needed to fight a lengthy prison term. How many of todays prison population is in jail because they can't afford to defend themselves. I know many people have done research on this issue but I did this post as I am perhaps a little closer to actual court proceedings and some luck that most don't receive. I really think this is just some thing far away from most people but in reality, the USA has a larger prison population per capita than many banana republics

I think the USA needs to do more to clean up domestic prison crime issues etc before lecturing the world on how the americian way is so good. Actually it isn't so good as I have found out 1st hand, but that is another post.

My experience in the USA is this: the americian way of justice is nothing short of the wild west and a boast that caan not be vewrified. You should not lecture the world until you are in a position to lead by example

And you wonder why so many people in other countries despise you. You make enemies much faster than you make friends. The sad part is the common americian person is naturally friendly and really good people. Your leaders are the reason why you have a problem, with the world. You need to get contol of the deep state industrial arms complex before real progress will ever happen

These people need constant american enemies

Comments
By metmike - Feb. 14, 2020, 3:04 p.m.
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Wayne,

In the US, if you can't afford an attorney, you are entitled to a court appointed attorney.

They are called public defenders and some of them are pretty dang good and since they do it for free(no charge to the client) many of them are motived to seek justice for poor people vs just doing it for the money. 

It's a huge misunderstanding and mis-characterization when people make blanket, stereo type statements   about all the poor people being in jail because they couldn't afford lawyers like the rich people(who get off because of the lawyer).

For sure there is some discrimination in the justice system against poor people but every one of them is offered a free, public appointed attorney if they don't have the money to pay for one. 

If they aren't, then the court/judge/prosecutor are not following the law. It's part of their basic civil rights. 

Your son was from Canada. so I'm not sure how that would have worked out. Are non US citizens charged with crimes here offered free lawyers too? Probably they are.

No doubt you son is not poor, so we know he would have had to hire and pay for his own attorney. 


Here's the info on that from our county here in Southwest Indiana.

Public Defender's Agency

https://www.evansvillegov.org/county/department/index.php?structureid=38


By wglassfo - Feb. 14, 2020, 6:44 p.m.
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And you really think these public defenders do a good job

Yes some eager beaver types do a good job. Watch enough TV and you will be a beliver

A high profile case will attract many public defenders for free

A low life B & E will find a lawyer that wants a guilty plea, even offering to have the sentence reduced to avoid trial by jury

Rarely does anybody ask if the person is actually guilty. A good lawyer never asks that question. The assumption is guilty as the prosecutor must have the evidence. The evidence may be tainted but who cares

You realize the court system can not possibly handle every case in a jury trial

You realize public defenders don't have the time for a jury trial on a simple B & E

So: Most public defenders meet their client minutes before the appointed court time

The accussed is usually offered a reduced charge/jail time etc. especially if they are charged on multiple charges, if they plead guilty

Most are not educated and easily convinced to take the lessor charge

Most never see a trial by jury

Judges don't want their docket fouled up by trial by jury as they simply do not have court time to have every criminal ask and receive a trial by jury

Yes there are some good public defenders but nobody can live on the county paid rate

My friend from Florida said his biggest problem was corrupt judges

He was strictly a defense lawyer and worked his own practice

I learned a lot from him, as he sold his practice and is now retired

I was on a jury twice in my life time

In Canada we are not permitted, by law, to repeat our jury time in public.

Lets just say I was not impressed by my experience

Your community may be different

By metmike - Feb. 15, 2020, 12:38 a.m.
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Wayne,

I don't know the system well enough to tell you how good most public defenders are.

I know a person that was in huge trouble with the law for numerous years. His family had the money to pay for several lawyers. The most expensive one did a horrible job, the other 2 were mediocre.

Then, they cut him off and he had to get a court appointed attorney, Mike Hayden when he could no longer afford to pay for an attorney. 


Better than any of the other ones that were paid by a mile.  Mike also has his own private practice, which it appears all the court appointed attorneys do.

https://www.martindale.com/attorney/mr-michael-j-hayden-974959/


I'm guessing that individual attorneys act as public defenders for brief periods in their career(for various reasons) but that is not their career.