no crime just a gun problem ya right
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Started by cutworm - May 26, 2021, 8:41 a.m.

No, our crime issue is not a 'guns issue' (msn.com)

White House press secretary Jen Psaki refused to say that the U.S. has a crime problem, telling reporters that, “certainly, there is a guns problem.” Connecticut Sen. Chris Murphy insisted that it is “not a coincidence” that gun sales and gun deaths both rose in 2020.

BUT

Of course, Murphy is right about the raw statistics, but his inference is pure fallacy. Crime did not increase by 50% in the last two months of 2008, when gun sales increased by 50%. Crime did not increase by 51% in summer 2012, when gun sales increased by 51%

Gun sales are constantly surging, yet the homicide rate fell throughout the 2010s as gun ownership steadily increased. Gun manufacturers doubled their annual output from 2009 to 2013, as former President Barrack Obama unwittingly became the best gun salesman in the country, yet homicides and violent crime declined.

In his fog of confirmation bias, Murphy is probably also confusing cause for effect. According to a study released by the Department of Justice in 2019, only about 7.5% of criminals who use firearms during their crimes do so with guns purchased at gun stores. It is far more likely that gun sales were a response to the spike in homicides, not the cause of them.


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By metmike - May 26, 2021, 1:12 p.m.
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This is very true!

It's some times  challenging to see cause and effect in realms like this.


Much trickier than most realms to see people buying guns AFTER  or BECAUSE OF crime rates going higher, when it also makes sense that more guns out there would cause more homicides if you want to push that narrative.

Related to this is the fact that geological studies all find that temperatures in earth's past went up...............BEFORE the CO2 went up. (probably because of the outgassing of CO2 into the atmosphere from the warmer oceans-just like your soft drink loses CO2 to in the warm air).

But they use the correlation to show that CO2 CAUSED the temperatures to warm up. No, it happened the other way around in the past.

The CO2 did go up first this time but, please, don't misinterpret the authentic science in the past to manufacture the opposite reality of what really happened. When you have to resort to tactics like this............it means your authentic science is not powerful enough, so you have to manufacture fake science to support your position..........which means you you don't care about the truth.............you just want to convince people of YOUR science.....not the real science.

By TimNew - May 26, 2021, 1:41 p.m.
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As any statistician will tell you, and you most likely know, corelation does not prove cause/effect, it proves a relationship.  Very different things.    The corelation indicates the need for additional analysis to determine the reasons for the relationship.

Anytime I see corelation used to prove cause/effect, I question the knowledge involved, and almost always find an underlying agenda.

By metmike - May 26, 2021, 9:09 p.m.
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At least 8 killed in San Jose shooting

https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/san-jose-ca-shooting-05-26-21/index.html

"The mass shooting is the 232nd incident in which at least four people were shot in the US so far this year, according to a tally by the Gun Violence Archive."


https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/Number of Deaths in 2020
By metmike - May 26, 2021, 9:35 p.m.
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I will step outside the debate on guns and point to an element that would save far more lives than any other.

Our society has evolved into one where hatred of others is very acceptable in many realms.

We know that its wrong to commit "hate" crimes based on a persons ethnicity or race or religion and there's plenty of that to go around but its totally acceptable and even encouraged to hate other people that disagree with you politically. 

The side that fights against recognized hate crimes the most............gives their stamp of approval to others to hate people that have a different political ideology from them. To hate cops. To hate Trump. 

People communicate all the time on social media with complete strangers using hatred....and they never even met those people before. And often, its about something related to  political ideologies.

BLM (sorry to single them out) is not about love or understanding or working together with those they disagree with.

They promote hatred of police. Widespread riots are an extreme form of hatred and selfishness and not caring a lick about the millions of innocent people in those cities that they are messing up. People they never met with families and children and good cops that want the same thing that they do...........but they are being taught to hate.

Watch FOX or CNN or MSNBC(when Trump was president. They taught their viewers to hate the president of the US because they hated him.

In a society of people like this, the mentality will lead to mass shootings by the mentally ill and others NOT mentally ill that hate  people they don't even know.

Think about it. In the hundreds of mass shootings this year, how many do you think happened because the mass shooter loved the people they killed?

Hate and lack of caring about people that you have decided to hate is the main reason....or complete detachment from caring about those people and no ability to see thru the eyes of those victims............the suffering/pain you are about to inflict on them.

Society and politicians and the MSM and social media teaches us/them that the ends justifies the means and to never negotiate or try to reconcile relationships.  If there are people around you that you don't like or disagree with.............shoot em dead.

 Mentally ill people who love somebody don't shoot them.

The mental illness(which might not be controlled) must combine with the HATE.

In some cases, HATE by itself will trigger an extreme response like this. 

Exactly where are people getting messages of love to counteract all these messages of hate?



By WxFollower - May 26, 2021, 9:42 p.m.
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Mike,

 I think you mean MSNBC rather than CNBC. CNBC is ~neutral and how CNN used to be imo. MSNBC is solidly left.

By metmike - May 26, 2021, 9:45 p.m.
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Thanks Larry! I make alot of typo's. 

It also applies in the Middle East. The hatred for the state of Israel and the Jews by the Muslim world is off the charts.

It's almost entirely responsible for all the problems.

Kids growing up in the Arab world are taught this, so how would they know better?

Well, here in the US, we are subjected to a subtle version of this by the media and politicians that gradually is eroding our respect for each other in political realms and as human beings.

I am all for assisting black and brown people so they can fully enjoy the American dream but not to single them out in every realm and always have it revolve around their skin color and anybody that disagrees.............is a racist and we need to hate them.

How about just treating everybody as equals and with humanity regardless of what their skin color, religion OR POLITICAL PARTY/AFFILIATION IS.

No more us vs them and teaching us to HATE THEM mentality. 

We are all in this world together.