Is the pope Catholic?
Does a bear S in the woods?
Is Israel committing genocide in Gaza?
Previous thread:
Poll of Israelis and Palestinians
Started by joj - Sept. 16, 2024, 8:38 a.m.
https://consortiumnews.com/2024/11/28/us-backs-starvation-in-gaza-at-thanksgiving/
Palestinians in Gaza are now facing their second winter amid Israel’s bombardment and near-total blockade on humanitarian aid, which began in October 2023.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/longform/2023/10/9/israel-hamas-war-in-maps-and-charts-live-tracker
We are supposed to be a civilized people!
The unimaginable atrocities being imposed on 2+ million people, almost half that are children because of hate and revenge prove otherwise in this particular case. And the United States continues to fund the horrific genocide!
While we enjoy our yummy Thanksgiving feast in the comfort of our homes, completely oblivious to the reality of the shocking human suffering going on in Gaza. In fact, many SUPPORTING IT out of complete ignorance and lack of empathy.
Re: Re: Re: The horrific Genocide ramps up
By metmike - Feb. 25, 2024, 7:33 p.m.
Let those images burn in your brain and realize they represent a minuscule fraction of what's happening to fellow human beings in Gaza..........INTENTIONALLY!
Good for them!!!!
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No big deal. Just more words on a computer screen that say "21 people killed"
They aren't Americans. They aren't Jews. They aren't anybody we know.
What's the difference between 44,532 and 44,553? Those are just numbers NOT REAL HUMAN BEINGS!
After 426 days of the war and being bombarded with this every day........THIS IS THE NEW NORMAL.
This can't be genocide because the ones committing the genocide (and their blinded supporters) tell us its not genocide. NOT!!!
Amnesty International says Israel is committing genocide in Gaza. They aren’t the only ones reaching this assessment.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/12/6/who-accuses-israel-of-committing-genocide-in-gaza
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In other breaking news that we knew already:
1. Water is wet
2. The sun is hot
The most incredulous thing for me are the millions of people that justify this genocide with the ludicrous insistence that “Israel is defending itself to defeat Hamas”
The only way that rationale works is if they are killing 10s of thousands of children to make sure they dont get the chance of growing up because they might choose to join Hamas.
ironically, with the 1 million children that they are starving and destroying their childhood and killing their families and people ….they are giving them the most powerful incentive known to mankind to grow up hating Israel so much that they will dedicate the rest of their lives seeking revenge to destroy Israel.
Thats not speculation by me.
israel has generated more future Hamas like thinking people in the last year than was recruited by Hamas itself in any 1 year in history.
Those that understand the principles of hate being indoctrinated into children at a young age are watching the quintessential example of Israel indoctrinating hate for Israel……its own country on the biggest scale in history.
Thank you, Netanyahu for being the worst leader of Israel in history!
The revenge and hate inspired, massive GENOCIDE continues unimpeded.
now well past 1 year, news of horrificcrimes committed against 2 million, mostly children and women is accepted as normal.
Death and decimation are just numbers on our screens not real human beings with unthinkable suffering. The cost for Christmas presents here in December matters more to most Americans.
https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/why-did-israel-kill-last-orthopedic-surgeon-northern-gaza
Dr Saeed Joudeh, the only orthopaedic specialist in northern Gaza, was fatally shot in the head by an Israeli quadcopter last Thursday while travelling between Al Awda Hospital and Kamal Adwan Hospital.
According to Gaza's Ministry of Health, Joudeh was hit directly and died from the injury. He had previously been injured two weeks earlier. Joudeh regularly commuted between the two hospitals to address severe staff shortages.
His killing is not merely the loss of a single physician but a calculated act within a broader strategy to incapacitate Gaza's healthcare system - critical not only for treating injuries but for enabling the population to heal, recover, and sustain resilience.
With Joudeh's death, the number of medical sector staff killed has now reached 1,057, according to the Ministry of Health.
This attack took place amid intensifying assaults on northern Gaza's healthcare infrastructure, which form part of broader practices - such as starvation and attacks on shelters - intended to achieve the "Generals' plan" of depopulating northern Gaza.
Kamal Adwan Hospital, one of only three partially functioning facilities in the area, has faced relentless attacks, including drone strikes, ground invasions, and bombings.
In one such assault, a 16-year-old patient, Mahmoud Abu al-Aish, was killed by a drone strike while in his wheelchair, and at least 12 other people, including medical staff, were wounded.
Israel's systematic and unrelenting attacks aim to obscure and extinguish the last remaining efforts of Gaza's doctors, fighting to save lives amidst the mass killing
Re: Re: Re: The horrific Genocide ramps up
By metmike - Feb. 25, 2024, 7:33 p.m.
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/102430/#102490
The United States continues to fund and support this unimaginably horrific ethnic cleansing.
While sources like Fox News still tell us that it’s just Israel defending itself. and their infallible charlatan, Mark Levin condemning people like me as being “antisemitic“ for speaking out about the truth.
Israel's ground and air campaign in response has killed more than 45,000 people and wounded more than 107,000, according to Gaza health ministry figures, displaced most of the 2.3 million population and laid waste to much of the coastal enclave.
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Over 7% of the total population has been injured or killed, half of them children and women.
The number killed and injured so far, is almost 8 times the total number of men that are members of Hamas.
Hamas members ~20,000
Total killed and injured in this genocide ~152,000
Re: Re: Re: The horrific Genocide ramps up
Bare Bones argument: 4 issues.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4m_EL9Dj2U
Can Hamas stop the killing in Gaza?
Does Hamas promote the killing of civilians?
How would we act in similar situations?
Before you go on about my Bias, I would like a response to his Arguments.
EDIT; fallow up
Thanks a bunch, cutworm,
He goes on and on and on about things that I never mention in my zillion posts about why this is an unjustified genocide being perpetrated against almost all innocent people, mostly children and women.
In his 12 minutes of mostly justifying the unjustifiable war he spends just a few seconds to discuss the horrific genocide. Telling us "this the irrelevant context. Civilians are always killed in war." Then, he goes on to tell us its the fault of Hamas and they can stop the killing. His entire position is based on justifying this as Israel defending itself which I have proven dozens of times is NOT TRUE.
Blaming Hamas for the deaths of people in Gaza instead of Israel. That was busted hundred of times by the stone cold facts.
It doesn't come close to explaining Israel starving 2 million people and depriving them of water and medical care(which he conveniently never mentioned). There is no justification under any circumstances, including these to do that to 2 million innocent human beings. It's called collective punishment.
I noted he never mentioned any of that because he knows there is no excuse. None. Never! There is MUCH MUCH MORE than just Israel killing and injuring innocent woman and children with bombs and guns.
They have trapped 2 million people that they intensely hate in a small space with no place to go and are using Oct. 7 as an excuse to starve them, deprive them of water and medical care, torture and kill them with unthinkable atrocities being perpetrated on women and children that had ZERO to do with Oct. 7. Kill their doctors. Kill the media reporting in Gaza. Kill the humanitarians there to help the people in Gaza. Destroy all their hospitals.
Whether Oct. 7 killed 10 people or 10,000 people there will NEVER be justification for this. He, like others spend way more time trying to convince us (several times in his speech) that the scale of Oct. 7, somehow justifies what is Israel is doing.
Nope. Not even close.
He spent almost ZERO time discussing what I have been showing and object to.
Forget the history of Oct 7 and everything that happened before them. Forget everything else. There will NEVER be justification to do this to 2 million people, using "Israel is defending itself" as an excuse.
The only way that makes sense is that Israel has ESP and they know which women will have children that grow up to join Hamas, so they have to kill those woman first. And that the many thousands of children they are killing in cold blooded murder must receive the death penalty today, instead of letting them grow up and possibly decide to join Hamas.
This is galactically ludicrous and much of the clear, objectively thinking world has not only spoken out against it, they've taken actions against Netanyahu, labeling him as a war criminal.
This guy starts out by trying to convince us that he started with an open mind and used the facts to come to these conclusions.........then, he rambles off 1 sided facts to support ONLY his argument and not once, addresses authentically what my main points have always been about here. Nor does he present ANY legit facts regarding the arguments that I have presented here for over a year. NONE OF THEM!
Just to remind you. For 6 decades, I was indoctrinated in the Catholic Church and taught that today's Jews are the descendants of the Israelite's, the chosen people of God in the first testament.
After the Oct 7th attack I was extremely outraged and 100% behind Israel.
But then, I set my off the charts pro Israel bias aside so that I could objectively observe and interpret with an open mind. I did dozens of hours to study the history.
Man, that was painful because seeing the light meant acknowledging things that I wish were not true right now. It means speaking out for the truth, regardless of my religion, country or political affiliation.
However, with the pain comes authentic discernment. That's the reward and that part feels great.
In fact, much of the time, when we have to make tough choices that allow us to see the authentic truths that go AGAINST what we want to be true, we find the reward of authentic discernment.
It's especially authentic and rewarding when its a complete flip of what we thought was true before we delve into all the comprehensive facts.
Just to repeat. There will be a debate forever regarding the history that led up to this with neither side budging. I am ok with having discussions about that.
Since you read my posts, you will note that I NEVER discuss that(like this guy did).
My points, which were shrugged off by this guy relate to the unthinkable atrocities that Israel is intentionally imposing on THE ENTIRE population.
Crystal Clearly, with near 100% certainty based on the authentic facts, they are doing it out of hate and revenge and selling it to the world as "eliminating Hamas" or "defending Israel".
I considered every single point that he made and am extremely familiar with all of them already because that's almost exactly the way that I used to think!
I see that you posted another link. Thanks again.
This time the guy really goes on an unjustifiable nonsense tangent, trying to justify his proportional number to our 9-11.
That's blatantly disingenuous and hypocritical because of this:
Israel is a country of 9.7 million people and Hamas killed 1,139 of them =0.0001
Gaza is a country of 2.2 million people and Israel killed 45,000+ of them. .02045
If he wants to use the proportion game, then I will gladly accommodate him/you.
Using the authentic statistics, Israel has proportionally killed 205 times more people in Gaza than Hamas killed in Israel.
In fact, if you include the missing people in Gaza, Israel has killed or injured 7% of the entire population!!!!!!! The vast majority of them NOT Hammas. Over half women and children. They've killed or injured almost 8 times more people in Gaza than even existed in Hamas to start with. Geesh!!
Hamas killed 37 "minors", including 2 babies on Oct. 7. VERY FEW CHILDREN. Israel has killed 18,000 children, if you include the missing, more like 25,000 children. So Israel has killed over 1,000 times more children(NOT ONE OF THOSE CHILDREN WAS HAMAS).
Israel destroyed all the schools, hospitals and something like 90% of the structures have had damage. Taken away their food, water, shelter and medical care. Killed the media. Killed the doctors. Killed humanitarian workers.
Hamas did NONE of that. Again, he wanted to bring up proportionality not me.
I just busted his arse to smithereens!
You can believe him if you want, cutworm. You obviously posted me 2 separate links of him because you do.
I listened to every word he said out of respect for you and addressed it.
With authentic facts!
"You can believe him if you want, cutworm. You obviously posted me 2 separate links of him because you do."
Not so fast. I'm not convinced either way. I posted the second as more reference.
I see the first Oct 7 as a pure terrorism, all civilians. I do not like killing anyone, but self-defense unfortunately sometimes requires it. Sometimes the only defense is a strong offence when the enemy says that their only objective is to kill you and yours.
Then the argument is about civilians. No one wants them hurt, but do they share any responsibility for their elected government??? What about the way that the civilians acted in the wake of Oct 7??
Would the IDF stop if the hostages were returned??? If they do not return the hostages and punish the perpetrators does that not reinforce the idea that they just want to mercilessly kill us???
--mm
"ironically, with the 1 million children that they are starving and destroying their childhood and killing their families and people ….they are giving them the most powerful incentive known to mankind to grow up hating Israel so much that they will dedicate the rest of their lives seeking revenge to destroy Israel.
Thats not speculation by me.
israel has generated more future Hamas like thinking people in the last year than was recruited by Hamas itself in any 1 year in history.
Those that understand the principles of hate being indoctrinated into children at a young age are watching the quintessential example of Israel indoctrinating hate for Israel……its own country on the biggest scale in history."
cw
I believe that those children were (are) indoctrinated to hate christens and jews from the time they were born. The way that the civilians acted in the wake of Oct 7 shows this. That is a stark difference in their way of thinking, not everyone thinks like us. They even tell us that they want to kill us.
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I see both side and am confused and still searching. When is war justified. If it is justified, you must do everything to win.
all these things are in my head.
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This is not an argument:
Is the pope Catholic?
Does a bear S in the woods?
Is Israel committing genocide in Gaza?
In other breaking news that we knew already:
1. Water is wet
2. The sun is hot
-----
thanks, cutworm,
i get fighting a justified war between 2 sides to win but we should note that there is very little actual fighting going on in this pseudo war in Gaza.
It’s 99.99% one sided, with extremely powerful high tech and 100 thousand tons of huge bombs(200 million pounds) , administering collective punishment against a totally defenseless people that have no means to fight back. The majority of them being children and women.
Based on revenge for October 7th that has already dealt out punishment exceeding the original crime by several orders of magnitude and against, mostly innocent people that were not responsible for the crime.
Half of them that were children for Pete’s sake. In no bodys world , except those blind, in denial or obsessed with hate is intentionally slaughtering children on a massive scale like this (under a ludicrous justification of self defense) anything other than genocide.
EVERYBODY actually looking with open eyes, at the details of the many, MANY hundreds of specific cold blooded, indiscriminate killing incidents has known for some time that this is clearly a genocide.
Since this isn’t enough for YOU, cutworm, what would change your mind?
With nearly 90% of the buildings damaged, are you waiting for 100%?
With almost 7% of the entire population killed or injured so far are you waiting for them all to be slaughtered? which apparently, for some folks would be the best outcome for Israel's future.
Most of the doctors have been killed. Hospitals destroyed. Very little water, food, or medical care.
So you can’t be waiting for those metrics to get worse because they are already at the most extreme inhuman living conditions that anybody could ever fathom.
So what criteria are you waiting for to figure this one out, cutworm?
For sources, like this guy at your links, to tell you it’s genocide Instead of justified?
Even after I listened carefully to both videos and completely obliterated his position with authentic facts, you still want to cling to the belief that his side has a legit case which is making it so extremely difficult to decide what’s right and what’s wrong.
If that’s the case…….there are almost no conditions for this to be genocide……until, maybe when everybody in Gaza is dead.
Also, those tying this to the release of the hostages have it completely backwards.
Look at everything that Israel had done to Gaza..........yet Hamas still has 100 hostages.
Hamas has no power to fight back. They are completely defenseless. They have only 1 thing that gives them any power..........the hostages.
Netanya uses the 100 Israel hostages to justify killing/injuring 150,000+ mostly innocent people in Gaza and to blame Hamas holding the hostages for it all and yet, the hostages are still held by Hamas in Gaza.
If freeing the hostages is the REAL objective, then such a powerful force with the worlds most advanced detection technologies, killing and injuring 150,000 mostly innocent people but still not accomplishing that objective is pretty insane.
We know about an eye for an eye and tooth for tooth revenge justice but this is 1,000 eyes for an eye and 1,000 teeth for a tooth justice!
Hey Cutworm and Mike,
I asked for reactions to the first video at another board with this post:
“In this the host addresses 4 persuasive main arguments by the anti-Israel camp:
1) “History did not start on October 7th.” Central premise: “The state of Israel is illegitimate.”
2) “October 7th was a response to Israeli brutality and oppression.”
3) “Israel is killing civilians.”
4) “Israel is engaging in indiscriminate attacks, which is why so many innocent people are dying.”
————————
Opinions from you or others about the host’s responses to these 4 anti-Israel arguments?”
Two thoughtfully responded:
Poster #1: He tends to be an anti-Israel poster to an extent but usually he’s quite thoughtful in his posts, including here, and I think he’s much more anti-Bibi than actually anti-Israel:
“Israel is a legitimate state but the people running it are psychopathic criminals and need to be gone.
2,3,4 are at least partially true (2 is the least true because Hamas did not want a treaty to be signed between Israel and Saudi Arabia so this was their way of wrecking it) and part of The General's Plan, they want to perpetually occupy northern Gaza and force the people to flee closer to the border with Egypt. Northern Gaza will then be settled by Israelis (like settlements in the West Bank.) The best way to force people out of northern Gaza is to bomb and destroy their homes, hospitals and schools. Bulldozers have even been seen there, again very similar to the West Bank. Murdering journalists to cover up their illegal behavior too.”
———————————————-
Poster #2 is Jewish and very much a supporter of Israel’s existence (like us three) but can’t stand the current leadership and has heavily criticized most of their wartime decisions (similar to my and Mike’s views):
“ 1)“History did not start on October 7th.” Central premise: “The state of Israel is illegitimate.”
By this argument ALL countries are illegitimate. Everyone came from somewhere else as colonizers/settlers. Only people of Celtic origin should be in England, Wales. Only people that have pure Roman blood should be in Italy. Only people with Gaulish blood in France, pure Spanish blood in Spain. Every country in the Americas is illegitimate. So that first statement is complete BS.
Not to mention the fact that Jews have always lived in the area. Genetics show that Jews originated from the area being spoken of in the video.
2) “October 7th was a response to Israeli brutality and oppression.”
It will be argued that the brutality, oppression came because of the continued terrorist attacks. After the 67 war treaties should have been signed with Egypt and Jordan to give back the WB, with the exception of the old city of Jerusalem. Gaza back to Egypt, along with the Sinai. Neither country at the time wanted to negotiate with Israel. and by the time they did, they wanted nothing to do with Gaza, WB.
3) “Israel is killing civilians.”
Absolutely they are killing civilians, and need to do a much better job at not killing, wounding them. Hamas, IJ, Hezbollah attack mainly civilians unless directly confronted. If they had the capability, they would kill more civilians.
4) “Israel is engaging in indiscriminate attacks, which is why so many innocent people are dying
4 is the same as 3.”
This 2nd poster later added this as a reaction to this that was said by poster #1:
“Israel is a legitimate state but the people running it are psychopathic criminals and need to be gone.”
Poster’s #2’s reaction to the bolded said by #1:
“Bolded part is 100% true. Bibi is driven by rage, and not wanting to go to jail. He knows the only reason he is not in jail right now is because he is PM. If/when his government falls, he will wind up in jail. When new elections are called there is a strong chance that a centrist government will be elected.
Bibi's allies are basically followers of Meir Kahane and are members of Kach parties, which are supposed to be outlawed in Israel, much like how Nazi parties are in Germany. Yet as in German with their AfD party, they put on fancy clothes, makeup, changed their name, but are still at the root not different that Nazis in Germany for AfD, or Kach party in Israel.”
Those are great thoughts and points, Larry.
Thanks for reminding me about how Netanyahu is an extremely diabolical man.
Anybody that cares about Israel and understands what he’s done to cause hundreds of millions of people or more, in the world to be outraged at Israel’s state sponsored genocide.
i vehemently condemn hatred for any people or person based on their race, nationality, religion or gender!!
Very sadly, people are using this as a reason to hate Jews. Just like 9-11 caused people to hate Muslims.
Just a small group of bad apple, very evil men did dastardly things…….but sadly, because they are part of a minority, the majority that might not have good Jewish or muslim friends form unfair opinions or judgments.
I consider Larry and Joj to be good Jewish friends here.
When I see what is going on in Gaza and how it’s impacting peoples opinion of Israel and good Jewish people it makes me hurt inside.
We should feel empathy NOT hate for people that have nothing to do with this atrocity and have become targets of antisemitism!
Larry,
Im so sorry that SOB Netanyahu is causing antisemitism that makes Jewish people like you feel bad. I appreciate your objectivity, brilliance and sharing here.
Even American Jews that support Netanyahu don’t deserve to be hated because of an opinion!!
2 Jan 2025
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Re: Re: Re: The horrific Genocide ramps up
To anybody that thinks its unnecessary to keep repeating that link.......I'll stop when Netanyahu stops slaughtering innocent children in Gaza.
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What a sad joke. The IDF tortures prisoners to get them to say what they want, then send it out as propaganda and pretend that this is supposed to be proof that what they are doing in Gaza is justified and not really an horrific genocide which is decimating almost all innocent people, the majority of which are children and women.
https://tass.com/world/1898471
"Hamas is rebuilding its capabilities faster than the Israel Defense Forces can dismantle them. [The leader of the Gaza-based faction] Mohammed Sinwar oversees everything," Amir Avivi, a former Israeli brigadier general, told the WSJ.
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I've been adamant from the get go that what Israel has done has greatly inspired numerous times more people with the same objectives as Hamas than those belonging to Hamas in Gaza that Israel will have killed.
Netanyahu has created the greatest anti Israel terrorist recruitment tool/environment in the history of mankind.
That's what makes the claim that "Israel is defending itself" so galactically absurd.
Here on January 15, 2025, there are more people in the world that hate Israel and many more people that want to wipe Israel out than ever existed in the history of mankind.
For every member of Hamas killed in Gaza since the genocide began, there have been 10 times more innocent people injured or killed.....mostly children and women.
As billions of people around the world watched this happen in real time, using the advanced technology of horrifying images and descriptions of the most inhumane conditions imaginable imposed on these poor people, day after day, week after week, month after month, the hatred for Israel has been indoctrinated permanently into millions of people that didn't hate Israel before this.
And those that did hate Israel before are so enraged that will vow to devote the rest of their lives trying to destroy Israel. That number could be 10 times the number that existed in Hamas. Remember, there are 2,000,000,000 Muslims in the world. 100 times the number of Jews.
There is no unseeing what has happened for the past 15 months.
Again, I have always been pro Israel and raised to believe that todays Jews are the descendants of God's chosen people, the Israelite's going to Catholic School for 12 years.
I have always wanted Israel to not just survive but to do well and experience peace. After Netanyahu just multiplied the number of people who want Israel destroyed by a large number, there is no going back.
It's good to have a cease fire but there just is no way to take away the PERMANENT damage that this did in ways so profound that I now fear greatly for the future of Israel.
I would be very surprised if Iran has not been enriching Uranium at warp speed to make it higher and higher weapons grade with the objective of launching nuclear weapons to decimate Israel. They may already have such weapons and are just waiting for the best time to launch them.
What we hear from the media and gatekeepers is, like most information very unreliable. I take everything they state with a grain of salt. What are the chances that we are being told about all the top secrets of Iran's nuclear weapons program?
Especially since even the government experts likely don't really know.
https://www.cfr.org/article/what-are-irans-nuclear-and-missile-capabilities
Common sense prevails here. Iran has some brilliant scientists with the material and devices to make nuclear weapons.
After what happened in Gaza, why in tarnation would they NOT develop nuclear weapons???
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After reading the dumbest propaganda in my life, over and over about the war in Ukraine for 3 years that contrasts to the stone cold realities, for anybody with eyes, ears and a brain, it's crystal clear that we can't trust the media or government to report anything.
When it comes to this topic, there are few sources that KNOW the truth and even fewer sources that will TELL the truth.
It was actually very easy to bust all the lies about Ukraine because the information was readily available from numerous sources.
With Iran, nobody has a clue, just speculation. That includes me. Just speculation.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/1/15/what-do-we-know-about-the-israel-gaza-ceasefire-deal
https://www.newsweek.com/netanyahu-postpones-gaza-ceasefire-deal-hamas-crisis-2015854
Joe Biden has been bragging this week about the great deal that he negotiated for Gaza.
8% of their population killed or seriously injured with more new recruits for Hamas than those killed by Israel, who benefitted? injured, mostly children and women
Schools destroyed. Hospitals destroyed. Homes destroyed. Historical buildings destroyed. Almost No food. and water. no medical supplies.
joe Biden authorized many thousands of hipige bombs indiscriminately raining down on vulnerable, innocent people,
.
Worse deal in history, thanks Joe.
Not that different from the deal he got Ukraine. 1 million casualties, massive land lost, As the worst military leader in the history of mankind that also stole their democracy and right to vote away. Thanks, Joe.
"For every member of Hamas killed in Gaza since the genocide began, there have been 10 times more innocent people injured or killed.....mostly children and women."
That is a lie. My question for you is, did you make it up or read it somewhere.
Between 15-17,000 Hamas fighters have been killed. So about 2-1 civilian/military deaths. That is unprecedented in urban warfare. See Dresden, Alepo, others. Most are north of 10-1 ratio. Name we one time in history where a million leaflets were dropped to warn civilians to evacuate. You can't, and you won't because, as you have pointed out, you have the right to ignore my points and go on posting your stuff.
It is worth reminding readers, since you NEVER DO, that on October 7th, 2023, 6000 Hamas fighters invaded Israel and slaughtered1200 civilians. That isn't terrorism, that's a war. Well, when you start a war, there are consequences.
Side bar: I'd be willing to bet that Trump told Netenyahu to keep the war going until after the election. So, in addition to the 200,000 Covid deaths on his hands he has thousands of women and children's blood on his hands as well.
Just curious MM, does anyone even read these posts?
Thanks, joj!
Side bar: I'd be willing to bet that Trump told Netenyahu to keep the war going until after the election.
I totally get that Trump is islamophobic and Netanyahus pal and feel that he probably wanted rhe war to last longer than Biden(who was punished for the war in Gaza) but your/our theory does not make sense based on the exact same situation existing for the 1 year plus of the war WELL BEFORE Trump was elected.
Suddenly, it's Trump's fault the war dragged on this long?
Many sources are claiming that it’s ending now because of Trump. I don’t trust Trump in the Middle East just as much as I didnt trust Biden.
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"For every member of Hamas killed in Gaza since the genocide began, there have been 10 times more innocent people injured or killed.....mostly children and women."
That is a lie. My question for you is, did you make it up or read it somewhere.
Between 15-17,000 Hamas fighters have been killed. So about 2-1 civilian/military deaths.
Thanks for that too, joj. You should know by now that I don't lie here........I BUST LIES. And I tell inconvenient truths based on authentic, verifiable facts that are disturbing to people that don't want to believe them.
Thanks for the opportunity to demonstrate that, again. Actually, my 10 times number was very conservative because it's likely to be MORE than that. I included INJURIES. Using just deaths, it would be more like 4+ to 1.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Israel%E2%80%93Hamas_war
An analysis published in The Lancet has estimated a total figure of 70,000 direct deaths due to traumatic injuries.[45] The number of injured is greater than 100,000;[46] Gaza has the most amputated children per capita in the world.
Sources have doubted the Israeli figures (Hamas killed) by questioning the IDF's ability to distinguish civilians from combatants
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So the minimum of those innocents, injured and killed in Gaza(mostly children and women) is at least 170,000 based on the authentic facts. The top number of Hamas killed, which many think is unreliable because the IDF continually lies about everything is 17,000(which is the top number you provided). But we'll use that number.
Is 170,000 not 10 times greater than 17,000???
That doesn't even touch upon the starvation, lack of water/medical supplies, almost complete destruction of hospitals, schools and damage or destruction of 90% of buildings.
Those are indisputable, authentic facts.
Like I say often here, my favorite posts are those that disagree with me because they offer the most opportunity for somebody in the conversation to learn something.
In the past, I've learned a great deal of things from you, joj. You're a very intelligent man with some great insights(many that I strongly agree with, like universal health care, the Insurrection, the 2020 election, Trump being a bombastic, delusional narcissist, COVID vaccines, Jimmy Carter's life, ways to make the world a better place....etc).
On this, I'm learning(even more) how even, normally clear thinking people will vehemently reject some things they don't want to believe, no matter how much truth and authentic facts you bombard them with.
The stronger a person's affiliation is with a group or party, the less objective fact checking they will do of their own sources.
The more they disagree with another group, person or party, the more skeptical they are of anything and everything from those sources. They will often, completely reject all information from those sources as the starting point to every discussion.
Just curious MM, does anyone even read these posts?
You disappoint me, joj. Going off the topic to end with a derogatory, hateful attack.
You should also know by now, that I don't respond in kind to this sort of thing.
Instead, I identify when OTHER PEOPLE do it and analyze WHY they do it......while trying to demonstrate to others how to respectfully communicate with people we disagree with.
And try to apply in my own life, which is often hard to do(for me too) in this age of hate, divisiveness, intolerance and loss of the ability to see points of view that differ from what we want to believe.
And at the same time, tenaciously and vigorously speak out against atrocities against humankind and the diabolical people/agents that cause it, no matter what party, person or entity.
It was not intended to be derogatory or hateful. I was just wondering. It's as much a comment on my musings here as yours anyway.
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Hamas started the war.
We fought evil in WWII until unconditional surrender. But unlike Japan, who eventually surrendered to save their people, Hamas is a death cult and wants as many Palestinian martyrs as possible. They have stated so many times.
I agree with you on who/what Hamas is, joj!
I'm running a Scholastic Chess of Indiana tournament today but will be back later.
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Added:
We fought evil in WWII until unconditional surrender.
Pure justification using 2 completely different situations, joj!
In WW2, Hitler was the enemy that was committing massive genocide of the Jews. We were clearly the good guys stopping him and his horrific ethnic cleansing and treatment of the Jews.
In this case Hamas is the enemy but Israel is the one committing massive, indisputable genocide. Israel is pretending to be the good guys(with the vast majority of the world completely rejecting this fake premise). Instead of stopping genocide, like we did in WW2, Israel is committing widespread, horrific genocide to an entire country and absurdly claiming that this is how they defend Israel...........and they want us believe they are the good guys because a small % of the people they are killing and injuring are the enemy.
Genocide, as I showed before involves more than just killing and injuring so many people.
Depriving over 2 million, almost all innocent people, mostly children and women of water, food, medical supplies, shelter and basic needs for survival while damaging and destroying around 90% of the buildings in the country IS IN ADDITION to killing and injuring them and very much a part of the genocide.
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Having more debate on whether this is genocide or not by Israel and repeatedly trying to re-litigate something that was long ago decided by every authentic standard is just an indicator of the mindset of the people refusing to believe the stone cold, authentic truth. ......because they don't want it to be true and won't allow themselves to believe it because of an innate cognitive bias.
This leaves me with identifying the bias (respectfully) and trying to move forward with speaking out about the truth with this horrific genocide for those that want the truth and enlightenment.
People just don't use the likes button here but did use the like button below for this post.
6 likes
By metmike - Aug. 31, 2024, 11:24 a.m.
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I emphatically insisted to Alex (who was a wonderful moderator and human being) that we NOT have a likes button because all it does is promote political division, side taking and on most forums/echo chambers. They are usually just a popularity contest where like minded people act like mobs that reinforce each other, with no attempts to read or listen to messages from posters that disagree with their views.
Alex, on the other hand, actually WANTED to increase that dynamic because that is the recipe to increase traffic. Alex's main priority at MarketForum was to make money using ads, especially when it featured posters that told lies/pushed disinformation which generated strong reactions from other posters, which resulted in huge traffic boosting hateful fighting over political issues.
That's the biggest thing that I changed.
1. No more ads but that could change.
2. A moderator that FACT CHECKS disinformation and busts lies.
3. A moderator that has turned this into and ANTI echo chamber.
4. A moderator that has turned this into more or a blog site that speaks out against injustice in the world and targets the diabolical people and agendts.
5. A moderator that tries to spread positive messages and shares useful weather and trading expertise/analysis.
6. This was in response to your previous wondering why we don't have very many people posting here. You would be surprised, however at how much traffic/people that come here to read (lurkers that don't post). Often many thousands/day during extreme weather events. Not for political discourse/battling but just to get enlightening information.
7. I am totally ok with that. After the FAKE STEAL of the 2020 election, Insurrection and COVID anti vax, widespread intelligence stealing crisis in America, I was spending the majority of my time every day at MarketForum, busting lies/conspiracy theories/disinformation(using authentic facts) from uninformed/extremely biased posters that thought they could impose a mob mentality to turn MarketForum into another echo chamber. I presented the information, not as in a debate but in the form of definitive, scientific and non politically obtained, indisputable truths that destroyed their incentive to come here to push, biased political bs.
8. That's your explanation for the traffic to plunge. I give people here what they and the world NEEDS. Not what is currently feeding the alarming and escalating division, hatred and intolerance.
How to make the world a better place
29 responses |
Started by metmike - Jan. 9, 2020, 10:23 p.m.
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/45623/
9. joj, despite our huge disagreement on this issue, of all the posters we've had here, without a doubt, you've communicated the strongest messaging (many times) in support of the objective displayed at the thread above. You have given us your own "quote of the day" numerous times, indicated that you part with money to support "Habitat for Humanity" and many other times which tells me without question how good of a person that you are and I consider us, by far VERY like minded on issues that matter the most!
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https://www.newsweek.com/netanyahu-unable-move-gaza-ceasefire-deal-2017245