Interesting dynamic going on.
The always volatile Trump is beside himself in anger over the Democrats relentless investigations and attacks of him.
In fact, before the meeting to discuss infrastructure that he walked out of , the democrats met to discuss impeachment of him and Pelosi was making statements to the press about Trump committing crimes covering up. They have numerous other investigations going. In fact, now that they got control of Congress, they are using their majority to investigate everything that can be investigated about Trump...............to try to find something............to try to destroy him and impeach him.
They are creating the most unfavorable environment possible for them to work with the president on.
Clinton was investigated by Starr and impeached by a republican congress but they did not conduct numerous investigations after Starr presented his findings.
The MSM was on Clintons side too of course.
In this case, however, the position of the democrats is
1. We are going to get you no matter what. We will demean you and smear you every day all day.
2. Succumb to all of are requests and give us everything we want to impeach you and stop fighting us.
3. And give us what we want on infrastructure
4. On your fake border crisis. There is no crisis and even if there was one, it’s your fault and we won’t give you any more money for your immoral wall because Americans want open borders and unlimited illegal aliens because that’s who we are. We know because more people voted for Clinton than you in 2016......even with Russia causing you to win and you allowed it to happen and mueller wants us to keep his investigations going and now you are covering up all the evidence of all your crimes. Why else would you be satisfied with 2.5 years and 35 million to investigate you when there is so much more.....unless you are hiding a lot of crimes. We know there are crimes but we need more investigations to find them.
Mike, you can make all the excuses for his actions as you will, but the fact remains that he put his own personal needs before the most pressing problem in America. Our Infrastructure is vital to our national security, and is the one issue where Trump and the Dems have common ground.
right carl. can you or anyone imagine dealing with two imposters. They walk in and say hi we are to re investigate, re interview, re do what we just did for 3 years and you being so silly would say "fine lets sit and talk" and you two are just here to talk infrastructure ? you really are surprised the President is done with your silly asses...talk about fake outrage
"Our Infrastructure is vital to our national security"
But our southern border is not?
I'm not defending Trump on this Carl, he is getting all riled up, like we know Trump does. But you must understand Trump and the dems absolutely do and are playing him.
They are doing their best to rile him up intentionally. Trump is "Mr. Art of the deal" . This defines him, which is why he wrote a book about it. This has been a great asset to him during his career and so far as president as he renegotiates better deals for the US across the board.
He is Mr. negotiation..........not Mr. I'll give you everything you want, if in return, you give me nothing and in addition, investigate me and try to impeach me. I'm not sure that any president would go for that deal but certainly not Mr. Art of the Deal.
So are we to blame Trump entirely for not giving the dems exactly what they want and its his fault for hurting the American people and the dems are just trying to do their best for Americans.
Yes, that's how its getting reported again.
If Trump doesn't give the dems everything they want for nothing while they try to destroy him...........he's the bad guy.
How about the dems, at least stop trying to destroy and impeach him. Do you think that might make the environment for cooperation between them a bit better?
I don't know if you've ever had somebody determined to ruin you and try to take away something you cherish the most, but I'm betting that you didn't invite them to your wedding (-:
To put it differently.
What side is providing the most divisive and challenging circumstances for which cooperation and agreements can be accomplished between the 2 sides?
Why are we not seeing it that way?
Oh Come On MM!!!. Just because Nancy P et. al. has been harassing Trump for nearly 3 years with as yet unfounded allegations that a multi-million dollar investigation was unable to substantiate, and then, just prior to the meeting accused him of engaging in a cover up with zero evidence is no reason for Trump to be less than civil.
We know that republicans are expected to live up to a higher standard than dems. Republicans are guilty until proven innocent while democrats must be convicted based on evidence beyond unreasonable doubt.
The sooner Trump comes to terms with this, the sooner he can get down to the business of devoting his time to defending himself against endless unsubstantiated charges while allowing dems to make all the decisions.
I'm surprised I even need to explain this.
Pelosi: "But I can only think he wasn't up to the task of figuring out the difficult choices of how to cover the cost of the important infrastructure legislation that we had talked about three weeks before."
Pelosi continues to intentionally push Trumps buttons and pretends that she is trying to be non partisan and is acting for the good of the country.
She is very clever and is beating the volatile Trump at this game but is extraordinarily disingenuous.
If you really want to work out a deal with somebody, you don't hold a press conference to direct attacks on that person, using carefully chosen verbiage in order to maximize the amount of the enraging effect you can have on them.
And it worked extremely well.
One should remember, the objective here is to destroy Trump.
One can ask, if the side that is trying to destroy Trump(take the word literally), attacking him every day, investigating him in every way, shape and form after the Mueller probe came back without the hoped for crimes(that everybody was wrong on) would just try to get along with him, do you think we might have a deal done?
But Trump should be above all that for the good of the American people. This is true but we are seeing one of his many character flaws come out here as he attempts to defend himself against the relentless attacks. Sad.
But even sadder is the democrats acting innocent and pretending that they are not intentionally inciting and causing this.............only wanting the best interest of the American people(and Pelosi, 3 times today stating that she is praying for Trump-who actually believes that??), with the MSM giving their usual spin and saddest of all, those who actually believe it(which is the entire purpose of this game).
A guest on CNN just made a profound point. After they all agreed that only the fake republican from my home state of Michigan would ever vote for impeachment(my description of him).
"All you're going to do with this talk about impeachment or trying to impeach(which can't happen because there won't be enough votes in both houses) is appease your base and antagonize the other side"
Create more divisiveness, continue the lack of progress addressing serious issues.
But that's not what its about. It's about keeping Trump from being re elected in 2020.
Sad for the American people.
Here's another sad element to this. The president of China is monitoring every iota of this. He has everything at stake in this trade battle.
We can be pretty confident, that if Trump was elected for life or had strong support from his own country, especially on this issue, with it likely resulting in him being re elected, his position would be much different than it is now.
China wants to continue to take advantage of the US and rip us off if they can. The difference in the long run could be hundreds of billions or more. If the guy battling him, representing the best interests of the US is being threatened with impeachment, not supported by a lot of voters and may not get re elected, he would be crazy to agree to any long term agreements with this weak positioned opposition.
Wait for another 1.5 years, while incurring some short term damage..............then crush the United States as planned for the decade+ after that which is exactly what WILL happen.
Make no mistake, China will eventually be the world's number 1 economic power...........maybe by a wide margin in 2030. They have most of the competitive advantages. It's inevitable. The question is not whether we can stop this or not but how strong of a #2 will we be competing with them in 2030?
And are we going to remain very competitive with them during that time or just let them CRUSH us quickly, which was the path we were on..............and will go back too if nothing changes.
Two things...
1st, I agree that China can play a waiting game and watch the US defeat itself from within. It's worked before and, coincidentally, the dissension came from the same group.
2nd, and this may be optimistic, but I saw many of the same predictions about Japan in the 90's. There is an inherent flaw in the concept of government getting too involved in the private sector. Inefficiencies are subsidized and inovation is punished. If we can avoid falling into that trap, the US will ultimately prevail here as well.
Bill Clinton passed legislation while being impeached for covering up consensual oral sex.
You thought the sign was funny. Even the part that is clearly a lie.
"18 angry Democrats"...LIE!
"No obstruction." .... LIE!
Most corrupt president in US history.
Keep defending him.
Bill Clinton passed legislation while being impeached for covering up consensual oral sex. Lie!! Bill Clinton was impeached for Perjury.
You thought the sign was funny. Even the part that is clearly a lie. Lie!!!. Every part of the sign was true.
"18 angry Democrats"...LIE! On this was agree. Seems every democrat in the world is angry these days. So much for the old cliché "Ignorance is bliss"
"No obstruction." .... LIE! Lie!! There are no documented actions that fall under the legal definition of obstruction.
Most corrupt president in US history. Lie!!! You keep making this claim. I've yet to see your evidence. Apparently we're now seeing another redefinition, Corruption now = "Someone I really really don't like"
Money well spent. Cleared his campaign of Russian involvement. Like him or not, it’s worth it just for that.
What ? It’s about a third of what his golf outings have cost ? The hypocrisy is enough to gag a cat.
"Money well spent. Cleared his campaign of Russian involvement. Like him or not, it’s worth it just for that.":
Great point mcfarmer!
So, spending millions clearing Trump of nonexistant, likely manufactured crimes is money well spent? For my next trick, I'lll spend a few million putting out a fire that never started. Contact me for my paypal in the event you wish to contribute for this "justifiable" scam.
Tim,
You can disagree with whether the amount of money was worth it or not but mcfamer agrees with you that Trump was cleared of Russian involvement, which the investigation did do.
If there was no investigation do you think that other side would still have speculated and accused Trump of it? Of course they would have. He was cleared of Russian involvement from the most comprehensive investigation of a person that is possible and its still happening.
So the investigation cleared Trump. What other path, do you think could have exonerated Trump of colluding with Russia(under the current political environment)?
There isn't one.
mcfarmers profound point just made me think about this in an entirely different way.
In this age of fake news, spinning, twisting, manufactured and alternate facts, only an exhaustive investigation like this exonnerating Trump of colluding with Russia could serve as THE authentic piece of evidence that he DID NOT collude with Russia.
Thank you again mcfarmer for allowing me to see this much differently.
Tim,
If you think that the investigation was started for political reasons to get Trump and was unlawful or unjustified.............fine............but it backfired because instead, it cleared him of Russian involvement. Guys like mcfarmer are objective enough to see that.
MM, please, what other path. How about the one we are finally starting down and most everyone except the libs would admit.....the 7th floor of the FBi, the cia and trying to first frame Trump the candidate then frame the President. The first 35 million was spent after the first week when Meuller opened the FBI files and there was nothing there. He knew it right then and there
mcfarm,
We waste alot of money on alot of things in this country but under the current environment, I am seeing no other way that Trump could have been completely exonerated on Russia.
And, if the investigation was started based on a justice scam intended to get Trump, we now have a new investigation into that situation which will reveal the dynamics.
Stop fighting the other side based on interpreting it from a defending a negative/attack.
See the positives/facts above and focus on this below:
1. The probe exonerated Trump on Russian interference..........the reason it existed.
2. If the probe used improper, even illegal means to start the investigation, those responsible are now going to be held accountable and it backfires.
3. And it would prove what your side has been saying for 3 years about the bias to get Trump.
So it's a win-win-win for your side, if that's what happens. We don't know what the new probe will show but its outrageous that the side being investigated, would claim they are above such investigations and us taxpayers, that paid their salaries and for all these investigations should not know anything about what happened(as if it would reveal national security secrets- give me a break).
If they did things by the book, they have nothing to fear. The investigation into them, is not going to be able to make stuff up. It will show the facts. Let's let them speak.
There is a 0% chance, that if the facts show improper behavior, they will acknowledge it. They will:
1. Claim that corrupt Barr and Trump are doing this to get revenge(but facts are facts)
2. It is just another conspiracy theory(facts are facts)
3. They will spin the authentic facts into manufactured/alternate facts that justify WHATEVER they did.
4. They will attempt to BLAME individuals other than them.
Let the investigation facts/results tell us.
Oh,so you believe the Mueller investigation put an end to the "witch hunt".