I mentioned in a previous post,  unless there was a full and complete investigation by experts in forensic science, millions of people would never accept a Biden win

1st we had then lower tier millions who had very little influence. Now we see people in the upper tier of power and influence, warning about consequences

This country is almost a powder keg about to blow

People could get killed and then what happens??

It is interesting that Biden and his supporters don't want an investigation. They simply point to the courts and say nothing to see, it was a fair election

Millions of people don't believe those who say nothing to see

What will it take for a Biden win to be legit in the opinion of millions of people who have questions

Biden and supporters are not helping themselves when they won't agree to an investigation

wayne, biden and company would disagree. they ran an entire presidential campaign from a basement. no campaigning, no people at rallys, no enthusiasm but they had China, big tech, big pharma, and big media to cover for the corrupt Biden family and lie about the Trumps. And 1 day after the fraud all the above were suddenly calling him Mr Presidential Elect. Makes you head spin to realize just what as gone on

After the full and complete investigation of the election can we have a full and complete investigation of whether or not the holocaust happened and was Bush in on the 9-11 attack?  And then can we have an investigation of Ted Cruz's father being involved in JFK's assassination?  And I understand there is a lot of controversy about whether the moon landing happened or was it actually a Hollywood production.  

We need to allay the doubts.  Where have we come as a country indeed....

I'm also in agreement with joj on this.

We should continue to investigate fraud in the election...................like we should continue to investigate fraud of other things in life.

Yes, there was some fraud that has not yet been uncovered and investigating more will cause a few more incidents to pop up that we didn't know about before but the current position is to create a never ending narrative that always suggests there was massive fraud............but we just have not investigated enough to find it.

Question: When exactly does the end point happen and that narrative changes to........ok, we investigated enough to un cover any major fraud that could have flipped the election from Trump to Biden?

Answer: That end point NEVER comes. The only way that you will be satisfied is if, out of nowhere, after weeks and weeks of searching and weeks and weeks of bs mud slinging and providing almost all bogus evidence(that has obliterated the credibility of the sources) a miracle will happen and suddenly, all the evidence will miraculously show up and prove that the investigation paid off.

Since that will NEVER happen in the real world, the narrative will NEVER change.  We must keep investigating until millions of people feel they can trust the voting system.

The reason they don't trust it, is NOT because anybody stopped anybody from spending many thousands of hours investigating everything under the sun. There has been no lack of investigating. This is not the reason they haven't found the smoking gun yet.

If there was no murder, you will never uncover a murder weapon. 

The reason they don't trust it is because of the FALSE NARRATIVES that will not die "not enough investigating has taken place to uncover the fraud", which, somehow, has defied the investigative abilities of thousands of people looking and scrutinizing every nook and cranny and what bothers me.............is  many dozens of fake allegations that gain traction and get you guys all fired up over..........fake allegations.

When we can prove so many of these allegations as being fakes/false it does prove fraud. The ones making the fake/false allegations are the frauds.

Some of them being so silly just tells me they are dishonest and not looking for justice, they are trying to sow doubt.

Their mission is to sow doubt in the results of the election. This is wrong and 100% counterproductive.

It's no better than how the other side acted against Trump after he won with a legit result.

No, there won't be a bogus Mueller type of investigation for 2.5 years to try to destroy Biden but this is all about sowing doubt and not accepting Joe Biden as our president because the LEGAL votes elected him.

President Joe Biden! Get used to it and accept it because the people have spoken, even if you don't like their message.

Sorry for the harsh tone guys.

You are welcomed and even encouraged to bring up evidence of fraud always for discussion but just blindly repeating false narratives for the point of reinforcing a false message because you want to create an echo chamber is counterproductive to discovering the truth.

I realize that I let Cliff do this with impunity with his  hundreds of his silly meme's and fake stuff about Trump for over a year but I almost always responded to correct him immediately  on his bull.

Consider this as just a response about this topic and you have NOT violated any rules or standards. 

As long as you are not making personal attacks or offensive posts, you guys can post what you want..........even if this is what you still choose to post about.

I appreciate all of your posts, even those that I disagree with and understand that this is the way that you sincerely feel. 

We both know there was fraud. The question is: was there enough fraud

Honestly Mike, I agree with you. This election and a lot of baggage needs to be put behind us, before some body gets seriously hurt.

 The people do not understand a legal term of" no standing" They do not understand why dead people voted, why rules were changed by unelected officials and much more

The people will never accept a Biden win, when questions, once again, right or wrong, stay in the public domain

So: What is the answer???

I think the people are tired of unelected or elected people assuming the power to dictate terms to the people. This goes deeper than an election, but I think the election is the straw that broke the camel's back

Now as to officials dictating terms, we can only hope a vaccine will put things right and we can live a normal life, with nobody assuming power over our day to day activities

I have an idea the FBI and the IRS are doing enough back ground checking to satisfy what some people call the "Biden crime family" My worry is 1: this gets buried by the MSM or 2: Biden steps down and Harris gives Biden a pardon. Either out come would cause a wound to fester and could cause a problem with a lot of people, but let's not get ahead of our selves on that issue

Which leaves the election

My proposal is to not ask the courts to answer the question of who won. It is my understanding congress needs to answer these questions, not the court system. I would propose a complete forensic audit of the machines used in many states and the election commission in every state in question must  provide full and complete records etc, for examination

If an investigation of Trump was deemed acceptable then why would Biden object??

That forensic audit, complete with all records requested would be the end point, at least for me and I would think, take the wind out of many sails, while letting the chips fall where they may.

It is my understanding the Biden team does not want a full on forensic audit. I also understand that Powell and Trump had a meeting in the Oval Office. To be fair, Powell thinks some pubs won't stand their ground to audit the Dominion machines. Why some Pubs are fighting such an audit is way over my pay scale. It seems Rudy Guiliani and Powell are locking horns

If the Pubs and Trump can't get on the same page, then I suppose there is probably no there, there or some other reason to not shed too much light on what has or has not happened. 

If an audit does not happen, I think the people at the very least deserve a reasonable answer. A plain and simple answer, not a legal answer such as "No standing" or some thing the people don't fully understand One would think a forensic audit would be that end point you talk about

In a world with a collective 280 trillion of debt I don't think money spent on an audit would even be a rounding error. And, as a bonus, the USA could regain the high ground of fair elections instead of this constant drum beat of USA and fraudulent elections

As it stands today the USA is the talk off the world

Let's make Carter a happier camper

One thing up front…. I am not a Trumpster. I find his behavior, his never-ending tweeting, his insults, his bragging, etc etc totally “unpresidential”. Not surprisingly, people in other countries laugh at us.

Yet, one also has to respect the good things he has done. Not long ago, metmike made a nice list of his accomplishments. Unfortunately, the general public does not know much about such things, because our beloved MSM has been ignoring them all. (so did news agencies in Europe)

So here we are…

You said “Get used to it and accept it because the People have spoken”. I am fully aware that we have to get used to it, but have the People spoken???? No way!!!! It was not the people who have spoken. The People went to Trump campaign speeches, they did not go to Biden speeches. The People saw Biden’s performances during his rare appearances… they knew he was not fit to be President. 

A good portion of the People knew about the Ukraine affair. They knew about the Joe-Hunter-China connection.

Recently a poll revealed that 1/6 of the Biden voters would have not voted for Biden, had Barr not kept the current legal problems of Hunter under wraps till after the election.

It seems to me, this whole election was a well-orchestrated maneuver to take Trump out.

Election fraud? Dead people voting is fraud, but it’s not significant enough to change the outcome. Voter turn-outs of 125% is fraud. Is this significant? Maybe not.

What is significant though, IMHO, is the Dominion issue. I saw with my own eyes some 20k votes being subtracted from Trump and added to Biden. And this machine was used in many, many locations.

Just a few days ago, I read about a team that did a forensic analysis of the Dominion software, and they came to the conclusion that this software is designed to manipulate elections.

However, this little ‘insignificant, minor” issue was swept under the rug. “There is nothing to see… please move on” (I can’t even find a link for this article anymore)

So, we just have to accept it, and move on. I am sure, on Jan 20, Trump will be expelled from Twitter, and we won’t hear from him anymore.

It makes me wonder though….. many people are so upset about the never-ending complaints from Trump supporters, and from Trump himself… “it’s time for Trump, as well as his supporters, to quit fighting and move on”

Sure, that would be the adult thing to do. But then….didn’t the 2016 election create a never-ending circus about impeachment, “tipping points’, “bombshell news”. a 2.5 year investigation of Russia collusion, etc etc.

Shouldn’t the Trump supporters be allowed to start the same circus now?

Instead of saying Trump won, because he colluded with Russia, the new battle cry would be “Biden won, because he colluded with China”… or was it the Swamp People who orchestrated the Biden victory?

Of course, we all know, a serious investigation of this election will never happen.. the MSM wouldl stonewall it, and those in charge will not allow it.

BTW… from all the Dem candidates, I would have never picked Biden. I would have picked Tulsi Gabbard. She seemed to be so different from the Swamp People in Washington.

How much investigation will it take before people asccept there was no Russian collusion?  How much investigation will it take before people accept there was no "quid pro quo"?  

How many times do we show the video of the speech where Trump denounced Nazi's and White Supremecists before people will accept that he did not ever say "Nazi's are fine people"?

How many times do we show the video before people accept that he never suggested we drink clorox?

These and dozens of other questions continue to perplex me.

1. Kudos to Mike for his post above that even as a Trump fan he’s saying the election did NOT have widespread fraud against Trump and that we should accept Biden as the winner. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I think Tim made a similar post in another thread.

2. Tim,

 Trump never suggested the idea of drinking bleach or any disinfectant. However, he did seriously suggest while looking at Dr. Birx that the idea of injecting some kind of disinfectant should be looked into. Dr. Birx looked away from him when he said this instead of actually saying something like “no”. What bothers me even more than that is that Trump later lied by saying he was being sarcastic. He obviously was not being sarcastic. Why would he in the middle of a press conference be sarcastic about that to Dr. Birx? That would make no sense and wouldn’t be good either. He was just trying to get out of his faux pas. But instead of helping himself, he added a lie and made it worse.

I don't think he was being sarcastic and I don't think he ever should have said he was.  One of his many mistakes.

But, there is a process where disinfectants are injested/injected. Did you know that mega doses of vitamin C break down into amonia.  There are countless other examples.

Tim,

You make some wonderful points. There were all sorts investigations into Donald Trump that NEVER should have happened. They were actually absurd. The impeachment was completely absurd and embarrassed our country. 

Trump wanted to investigate REAL corruption but it was a political opponent, so the party of the political opponent can make up shist with a diabolical scheme and impeach him over it. They really did that!

The 30 million, 2.5 year Mueller Witch hunt. Makes me ashamed of our country. 

Wayne,

Since we know from the facts that  Joe Biden was very involved in numerous unethical acts, some where he was the key player, we MUST investigate it. There were likely crimes committed but maybe not by him ...........or maybe by him and it would not surprise me .  When you get caught telling lies about something, it means the truth is bad for you.

I am 99.9% sure though, that Joe Biden will be found completely innocent of any wrongdoing in any investigation.

Even as we speak, that decision was made weeks ago and they have already decided on how things will go with the current investigation in to Hunter Biden...........before its over.

Hunter announcing to everybody that he is being investigated is part of Joe Biden's team taking control of the narrative that we are going to be fed from now on regarding this case............watch, you will see:

https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/60077/#62814

Life isn't always fair or just though. Joe Biden and Hillary Clinton were and are protected because they are part of the system, Donald Trump was destroyed because he was an enemy of the system. 

That is just part of the system.

The thing NOT to do is connect the results of the election with those REAL  examples and that REAL corruption. WIth this past election, there were not a bunch of top level, unelected bureaucrats or  gate keepers in the DOJ or democrats rigging the election as they did in those examples above.

This was the American people's voice.

It may have been greatly influenced against Trump by his enemies targeting him for 4 years and all the false narratives they brainwashed people with..........but it was still the results of the legal voting.

I could buy what you selling  MM if light had been applied to the process. In many people's opinion there has not been near enough light applied to know. And I am afraid where this leads us is to Jan when 1 rep and 1 senator will object and then the fun starts...thank God for our founders who gave us a road map out of the mess the dems created with trying to rig an election. And for the life of the republic there may be a argument for martial law versus giving in to a bunch that tried to rig the election....again had we applied the proper light in the last few weeks instead of ignoring things we may have had this solved by now.

Biden got asked a question on Michael Flynn today and what was his response? To lie again he lied, bold face lied on national TV. This is what you get when you rationalize cheaters.

Bottom line on all those tactics being effective on Trump is that he caused them to be effective.

His big mouth and telling lies made him a sitting duck..............an easy target.

Easiest to hate political figure in my lifetime.

You might have to go back to Hitler to find somebody more hated(for much of the public and world).

Even world leaders of countries that have done horrible things to and killed countless of their citizens in the most inhumane ways during my life time were not hated more than Donald Trump. 

What if he had the personality of Ronald Reagan?

Bill Clinton? Obama, Bush..........anybody else!!!

Whether we like it or not, being elected president is a popularity contest and that is based on likeability.

Considering that, it's almost shocking that so many people can believe that President Trump was popular enough to get elected again and the election was stolen again.

What planet/country are you living in, man?

Donald Trump had everything working against him in 2020, including Donald Trump.

Yeah, I liked numerous of his policies but I also like UM football and don't think they should be National Champs this year.................because they didn't earn it............because THEY lost a bunch of  legal games.

mcfarm said: "And for the life of the republic there may be a argument for martial law versus giving in to a bunch that tried to rig the election."

----------------------------------------

 Martial law would be the exact antithesis of what cons are in favor of, less government, especially Federal. That would be consistent with an attempted coup to make Trump dictator of the US and end the US as we know it. In that light, there would be absolutely no argument for that insane option, especially with still no proof of widespread election fraud going against Trump. Trump is just stringing you and some of his other supporters along for his own benefit and he will keep doing so with no end in sight unless he is installed as a dictator or he runs and wins in 2024. Actually, I can also see this BS as the start of a 4 year long 2024 election campaign. If so, I wonder how he'd do.

 Unfortunately, I do think that very longlasting or even permanent damage has already occurred due to the unsupported claims of widespread election fraud. Future election counting will likely no longer be trusted, even with landsides. I do fear that our country is never going to be the same if it even survives intact.

 Do you want the US to break into pieces? I don't know how that would even work but your posts tell me you hate the libs like they're enemies and don't even like them being fellow Americans.

wow where to start with that mess larry. The attempted coup was against Trump [4 years ago and then for 3 more years} and what you advising is to just look right past that and again just shut the hell up. The next election comes along, there is so much fraud to this day millions have no faith in the vote and again you say...well just look right past that too????  Sure glad we have a republic governed by laws not men's silly wishes.

Had Trump had the personality of Bush, the left would have labeled him an idiot racist Nazi war criminal,  just like they did Bush.

The names of republican candidates/presidents change,  but the labels hurled by the left  do not.

BTW,  they tried to impeach Bush as well, (Both I and II to remove any confusion).  It's what the left does  now.  All "tools" must be used in their war against fascism.  And as we know, fascism has been redeifned as anything with which the left disagrees.

https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/12/sticking_with_trump_to_the_bitter_or_glorious_end.html   just take it from one of most knowledgeable men on the planet. The right is not here to cancel anyone, tell anyone to sit down and shut the hell up. to erase all lib think from social media, to steal and cheat only to further their agenda or to succeed for that matter....all that is the far left and we all know it. So please enough with the foolish childish games so blaming the right for wanting no more than to conserve our republic.