Previous threads:
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/92983/
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/92806/
I really liked the graphics at this source, though the geographical map can't be copied here.
Size comparison of balloon shot down below. Size of the latest object shot down on the right.
I joked a week ago, when they spotted another Chinese balloon over Latin America that maybe this will be like the classified documents and they will start showing up all over the place but here we go with another incident that JUST happened over Canada.
U.S. fighter jet shoots down object over Canada
WASHINGTON/OTTAWA, Feb 11 (Reuters) - A U.S. F-22 fighter jet shot down an unidentified object over Canada on Saturday, the second such shootdown in as many days, as North America appeared on heightened alert following a week-long Chinese spying balloon saga that drew the global spotlight.
Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau announced the shootdown on Twitter and said it took place over the Yukon territory in the country's north. He said Canadian forces would recover and analyze the wreckage from the object.
The Pentagon said the North American Aerospace Defense Command (NORAD) detected the object over Alaska late Friday evening. U.S. fighter jets from Joint Base Elmendorf-Richardson, Alaska, monitored the object as it crossed over into Canadian airspace, where Canadian CF-18 and CP-140 aircraft joined the formation.
"A U.S. F-22 shot down the object in Canadian territory using an AIM 9X missile following close coordination between U.S. and Canadian authorities," Pentagon spokesman Brig. Gen. Patrick Ryder said in a statement.
U.S. President Joe Biden authorized the U.S. military to work with Canada to take down the high-altitude craft after a call between Biden and Trudeau, the Pentagon said. The White House said Biden and Trudeau agreed to continue close coordination to "defend our airspace."
"The leaders discussed the importance of recovering the object in order to determine more details on its purpose or origin," the White House said in a statement.
Before we even find out what these objects are, it's incredibly obvious what's going on.
There is no way that in the last week, objects that were never there before are suddenly showing up and we're shooting them down. In fact, after the spy balloon incident, it would be less likely.
What has happened is that President Biden got embarrassed out the whazoo for allowing a Chinese balloon to cross Alaska, then the entire continental US before finally shooting it down.
In order to try to salvage his damaged reputation, he's become trigger happy shooting things down that have probably been there all the time the past few years and suddenly, the activities of these US military operations that would have been top secret in the past are being immediately announced to be broadcast to the world in order to show how powerful Biden and his defense team of fighter jets are.
This appears to be more propaganda 101 from an administration that continues to sink an incredible amount of resources into convincing people what to think vs making decisions in the best interest of Americans.
For some reason, they intentionally waited to shoot this one down, after being able to do it over Alaska but not doing it until it crossed over into Canadian air space........THEN shot it down. That smells like somebody trying to intentionally show the world that the US and Canada are working as a team.
The worst decisions so far could be leading to WW-3 with Russia/China and their allies.
I'll guess that these objects have nothing to do with China and are just props for Biden to pretend that he just gained US defense religion/damage control for last week's fiasco.
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/92983/#92991
OOOOOOOOOPS! LOL THEY'RE PROBABLY BOTH USA BALLOONS.
OHHHHHHHH, MAYBE, THEY WERE CHASIN' THE CHINESE ONE & COULDN'T KEEP UP!
♬ UP, UP & AWAY, IN MY BEAUTIFUL.~ MY BEAUTIFUL BALLOON ♫
Up, Up And Away (HD)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-UQ0-8ktAM
The 5th Dimension is an American popular music vocal group. Their music encompasses sunshine pop,[1] pop soul[1] and psychedelic soul.[2]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_5th_Dimension
+++++++++++++
https://www.timeout.com/usa/travel/best-hot-air-balloon-festivals-in-the-us
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OaBOKkvDMHs
When our grandkids were little, this was one of their favorite songs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr3jtrXc_hU
A question.
have we had an effective communication channel going on between us and China during this process?
or are we intentionally creating opportunities for propaganda to show up China and posture with a confrontational mentality to make Biden look strong…..instead of using diplomacy?
that was rhetorical.
we have intentionally turned Russia into a dangerous enemy. Can we afford to be so wreck less and do the same thing with China?
this isn’t just tariffs and economic and technological/energy competition.
these are Confrontations involving our military with male brain thinking/strategizing that has an extremely long history of making all the wrong decisions which end up in wars that could have been prevented with female brain thinking.
Very funny lady!
There’s a great deal that we don’t know about current tensions but we do now.
1.the US is already in a proxy war with Russia and relations between us are near an all time low and everything is going in the wrong direction very fast And even the most optimistic have to acknowledge a legit risk of WW3 if things don’t stop going in this direction.
2. if we get into a WW3, China will likely be on Russias side. 100% they won’t be on our side. Putin knows this. Recent events with the US and China are now another factor that will further embolden Putin. The awest is extremely mistaken into thinking they can isolate and destroy Putin that way. He has China, India and the Middle East s well as a few other countries. Every move that the west takes to isolate Putin, ends up backfiring on the West as it hurts us the most.
3.something just hit me. In the last 6 months, Biden has had a sudden conversion to US fossil fuel production After being extremely anti fossil fuels For the last few years. He realizes that russia and the Middle East have us over a barrel and dependent on their fossil fuels. Saudi Arabia laughed at him before the election, when he went over there to beg them and bribe them to produce more oil To lower our gas prices. Of course the fake green energy schemes are all underperforming in the real world and wake up call Too.
4. i sure hope the US has some sort of positive back channel communication with China right now. The only threat greater to our country than an all out war with Russia is a war with China. Biden is letting his ego and political posturing trump that risk.
Associated Press
https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/12/politics/lake-huron-high-altitude-object/index.html
It was the fourth flying object in less than two weeks to be downed over North American airspace.
Biden has become trigger happy in the high altitude skies to offset the damage from the Chinese balloon last week to manipulate our impressions.
I feel so safe..............NOT!
This actually makes me much more concerned about their obsession to manufacture propaganda to control what we think and extremely bad judgment when it comes to diplomacy with the 2 most dangerous countries/adversaries in the world.
If you think this is scaring China, then the propaganda is working.....on you but not on China.
Just a reminder that the US fed us tons of misleading propaganda on the first Chinese balloon. Often comparing it to the 900 weather balloons that go up twice daily around the globe and claiming that means it couldn't have been a weather balloon, when this type of balloon is totally different.
I'm not saying it wasn't an intelligence gathering balloon, just that the information they provided was based on exploiting people's knowing NOTHING about high altitude weather/science balloons that numbered in the many thousands during the last decade.
How do you navigate high-altitude balloons? We asked an Oregon aerospace company
After the captivating saga of China's "spy balloon" crossing over the U.S., we turned to the Tillamook-based Near Space Corporation for more context.
+++++++++
Yeah, right. They built multi million dollar Doppler radars across the country(and in Canada) in 1 week after the embarrassing Chinese balloon incident (-:
PROPAGANDA!
KEY WORDS: "MAY" & "PARTIALLY"
WHEW ~ SO THAT IS HOW THEY WERE ABLE TO DETECT THE ONES DURING THE TRUMP YEARS! THEY RAN THE ENHANCED RADAR IN REVERSE! I WAS JUST WONDERIN'. BOW.... I FEEL SO MUCH SAFER WITH THEM "BEHIND THE WHEEL"
LOLOL HAHAHA WHAT "TOOL FOOLS" THEY ARE!
I THINK YOU'LL ENJOY THIS, MM
MY FAVORITE PART OF THE VIDEO
Thanks, Jean,
was listening to npr just now.
each missile like this costs half a million bucks. In addition to the jet, fuel, recovery and other costs, we‘re talking about millions for each object.
Pretty expensive PR stunts by Biden!
their expert guest knew a lot in discussing the weather balloons that go up 2 times a day to measure conditions with a vertical profile of the atmosphere that takes around 2 hours. ….then they pop from expanding at the top of the atmosphere from expansion in the thin air. He didn’t say that, I did.
He got the number wrong too and once again, comparing this to what we are shooting down is misleading.
these objects are completely different.
Fox, lat night was pretending like this could be from aliens and as if Biden didn’t know if that was the case.
I KEEP WAITIN' TO SEE PICTURES OF THEM, TAKEN BY THE JET PILOT.
DON'T THOSE JETS HAVE CAMERAS? GO-PRO, EVEN. HOW'D THEY GET VIDEO OF THE UFO, FROM A FEW YEARS AGO, FLYING & DARTING AROYND SO FAST??!!!
LOL "THE ROSWELL REVENGE"
Jean,
They are pretending to be transparent, while totaling controlling and filtering what information they give to us, including the propaganda designed to make us believe in their agenda.
MY FAVORITE LINES OF THIS PSALM
PSALM 26
I do not sit with deceivers, nor with hypocrites do I mingle.
I hate the company of evildoers; with the wicked I do not sit.
_________________
A LOT OF EVIL IN THE WORLD, NO DOUBT
MIKE ~ FROM YOUR LINK: "There have been countless sightings, dating back hundreds of years, of what today might be called UFOs. Many of these have been explained as strange but natural phenomena or hoaxes, but many remain unexplained. As long ago as in 218 B.C., Roman historian Titus Livius or Livy recorded seeing "ships in the sky".
WHAT ABOUT EZEKIEL WHO SAW THE WHEEL, WAY UP IN THE MIDDLE OF THE AIR
Fox keeps sensationalizing the alien, UFO nonsense over and over and claims the White House is doing it….
not true
I WATCH/LISTEN TO VERY LITTLE MSM (FOX INCLUDED) WHEN IT COMES TO STUFF LIKE THIS. LOLOL IT'S GETTIN' TURNED INTO A LAUGHABLE PLOT FOR A SCI-FI MOVIE, IMO. I GO FOR KUDLOW TYPE INFO ~ STATS THAT I CAN SEE FOR MYSELF. ( I'M JUST NOT A SCI-FI TYPE SOUL ~ NEVER WAS )
DO I BELIEVE THERE MAY BE UFO SIGHTINGS? YEP, I'VE SEEN TWO. THEY ARE WHAT THEY ARE: UNIDENTIED FLYING OBJECTS. WHEN I WAS 15, I HAD A VERY VIVID DREAM OF FLYING IN ONE. BEFORE I LEFT FOR SCHOOL THE NEXT MORNING, I DREW A PICTURE OF IT & INCLUDED THE WINDOWS, ALONG WITH THE RED & GREEN LIGHTS ON IT. WHEN I GOT HOME FROM SCHOOL, I FOUND MOM HAD LAID THE NEWSPAPER ON THE TABLE, NEXT TO MY DRAWING. FRONT PAGE NEWS: A PICTURE OF A UFO, SPOTTED OVER VENEZUALA, OVERNITE. MY DRAWING WAS SPOT ON.
EDWARD SNOWDEN ALSO HAS A THEORY OF WHAT IS GOIN' ON. I BELIEVE HE'S CORRECT!
What Edward Snowden just said about UFO’s is TERRIFYING and should concern all of us.
Thanks much Jean!
I highly doubt there are aliens from outside this planet here. There are laws of physics that apply in the universe that make it impossible.
There's a minuscule chance that they are millions of years more advanced than us and somehow defying those laws. Generating enough energy to get here and move around seems the most unlikely.
It's impossible to prove this, so you will have extreme speculation about phenomena that people can't explain and its part of human nature to speculate and use our imagination.
Alot of inventions and creations happened because of this. But they all had to follow laws of physics.
Hold everything. We now have a completely new revelation from US officials.
The U.S. watched as it may have been blown off course, the official confirmed.
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/us-tracked-chinese-spy-balloon-launch-official/story?id=97220283
U.S. intelligence agencies tracked the Chinese spy balloon from its launch in China and watched as it may have been inadvertently blown into U.S. airspace, a U.S. official has confirmed to ABC News.
This latest revelation differs significantly from the previous narrative related by the White House and U.S. military officials over recent days, which has changed repeatedly since the balloon's existence became public when it was spotted over Montana on Feb. 1.
But a U.S. official said that just because the U.S. may have been able to detect when the balloon left a certain point did not mean that the U.S. knew that it would ultimately end up over the United States.
"A range of factors determine the balloon's trajectory, and it was not clear where it would be going," the official said.
The Washington Post was the first to report that the balloon may have been diverted from its original route and that the resulting incident and tensions with China might have been due, in part, to a mistake. It was said the balloon was on course to fly toward the U.S. territory of Guam when it took an unexpected turn north due to strong winds.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This is the complete opposite of what they stated before. That the balloon had some ability to maneuver and steer itself and was "hovering in place", meaning it resisted the strong winds aloft over Montana, that were probably close to 50 mph at that level at that time, since it took around 48 hours for the wind to steer the balloon 2,100+ miles from MT to SC.
1. Either it had maneuverability as they stated at first and it likely couldn't have gone this far off course and they are not being honest with the above statement or
2. It didn't have maneuverability and could have been blown way off course by some extremely bad meteorologists tracking the winds and they are correcting their dishonest initial statements.
If they were telling the truth the first time, then this can't be the truth. If this is the truth, then it's because their made up story the first time backfired. The only thing that we know with certainty is that they are lying part of the time and they will continually change their story to manipulate what we think...........propaganda.
And if the balloon went farther north than expected as they state, then the expected path, farther south would have been into Western Canada or the US West coast.
https://www.whereig.com/au-oceania/where-is-guam.html
Not sure if the path had anything to do with the nuclear sites below because, starting in MT it was tracking exactly with the upper level wind flow/speed. Unless it really was hovering, as first stated.
The spy balloon was spotted close to a nuclear missile site, the home of U.S. Strategic Command and the military base that is home to the B-2 stealth bomber.
https://fas.org/blogs/security/2006/11/new_article_where_the_bombs_ar/
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/02/nuclear-truckers/
Jean,
What I said from the beginning(when we were told the first balloon couldn't be a weather/research balloon) is that there have been thousands of research balloons and high altitude objects used in the last 2 decades to measure things like ozone, radiation, weather and other metrics.
They have only been increasing.
They have completely failed to communicate this to us in every way, shape and form. They continue to say things that are purely attempts to make them look good and convince us of what they want us to think. When it backfires, then they contradict themselves in an attempt to use a brand new position for damage control of the previous, backfiring position.
There is nothing they won't manufacture to create a narrative that they think makes them look good.
If they would have just stuck with the initial balloon incident embarrassment and acknowledged the failures............and went on, then the damage would have been much less than half of what their attempts at damage control have done.
That initial acknowledgement would have at least given them some credibility because of honesty that every American would have believed and most of us knew was the truth.
But they had to go nuts, suddenly shooting down objects and inventing crazy stories, with the last story being that maybe the spy balloon path was accidental by the Chinese.
I will guess that last one is to salvage diplomatic ties with China, which at least was the smartest thing done so far.
But nobody believes it now.
If they had come out in the beginning, before all this bunk and told us that this was a mistake by China............most Americans with an open mind could have believed that, including me, who pointed out that the Chinese have 300 satellites, some that can read the license plate number on your car.
However, gathering atmospheric and other data at 60,000 feet can only be done by instruments traveling at 60,000 feet NOT by a satellite much higher up or from the ground.
So the balloon WAS able to get data that satellites could not.
MIKE... SURELY PEOPLE ARE AWAKENING FROM THEIR WOKENESS!
IN THE MEAN TIME ~ NEWT CAN BE FUNNNNNY!! LOL
Biden says the 3 aerial objects shot down were not Chinese spy balloons
https://www.npr.org/2023/02/16/1157530528/biden-remarks-unidentified-aerial-objects-balloon
He said the three aerial objects shot down by U.S. military were most likely tied to private companies, recreation or research institutions.
"We don't have any evidence that there have been a sudden increase of objects in the sky," Biden said. "We are just seeing more of them partially because of the steps we have taken to narrow our radars and we have to keep adapting our approach to dealing with these challenges."
1. No threat? Of course they were no threat. Then why did we shoot them down?
2. No sudden increase in objects? Like I've been saying and THEY KNOW, there have been thousands of these the past couple of decades, for research and other purposes. They dang well know this and knew it before they shot these objects down. It had 0 to do with their supposedly sudden advancement in technology/radar applications.
3. They shot them down and wasted millions in tax payer funds as a marketing scheme to do damage control for the Chinese balloon fiasco.
It's pathetic that they have blatantly lied, showed extreme incompetence, wasted tax payer funds and may have started a new Cold War with China at the same time within a period of 1 week.
That's to go with the war the US/NATO is choosing to have with Russia right now. Killing off 100,000+ Ukrainians and obliterating that country for their political agenda and totally lying about all the dynamics going on there using nonstop propaganda.
Then there's the fake climate crisis and war on fossil fuels as earth greens up and its creatures enjoy the best weather/climate and beneficial CO2 in many thousands of years during the scientific climate optimum.
Russia and China are OPENLY evil countries but the West is SNEAKY evil. Even worse than China and Russia in some realms.
Wolves in sheep clothing. Pretending to be for good things............that cause tremendous harm to us when imposed.
Saving the planet...........doing things that severely wreck it.
Saving Ukraine............by having the country/people completely decimated.
They do it for capital and political cronyism.
Sure, there are many millions that are sincere about their beliefs, supporting these so called altruistic causes.
Only because they had their brains hijacked by scam artists with convincing sounding causes, with the media colluding and pushing the junk science, DISinformation and propaganda.
And the ones that see thru this scam...........because of their political alegiance, believe in their parties DISinformation, junk science and lies.
The 2020 presidential election featured widespread fraud.
The Jan 6 Insurrection was an inside job by the FBI meant to frame Trump.
The COVID vaccine hurts more people than it helps.
What % of people realize that all of it.........on both sides is just a bunch of bs?
A small minority of people.
The rest of the people are fighting for things that feature recognizing the lies of the other party while being oblivious to their parties huge lies.
LOL I "KNEW" IT!!!!!!